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HI, MY NAME IS SPIKE BARKAN, AND THIS IS PART OF AN ONGOING SERIES SPONSORED BY THE HASTINGS HISTORICAL SOCIETY, CONVERSATIONS ON THE HUDSON.TODAY WE'RE GONNA BE SPEAKING WITH JOHN MCINTYRE.
SO, JOHN, HOW, HOW LONG HAVE YOU LIVED IN HASTINGS? WELL, THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.
UM, I MOVED IN WHEN I WAS THREE YEARS OLD, AND I LIVED UNTIL I WAS 21, AND THEN I LEFT AND ONLY CAME BACK AS A, AS A SON WITH A WIFE AND A GRANDCHILDREN FOR ED AND MARY MCINTYRE.
SO, WHEN, WHEN YOU MOVED TO HASTINGS, YOU WERE, YOU WERE THREE WHEN, WHEN WAS THAT? 1932.
AND DID YOU GO TO THE HASTINGS SCHOOLS? EVERY BIT? EVERY BIT STARTED IN THE KINDERGARTEN AND THE AFTERNOON SESSION.
SO WHAT WAS THAT LIKE? UH, WELL, IT WAS THE CENTER OF OUR LIFE.
I, UM, MY FAMILY KNEW THE, UH, THE KINDERGARTEN TEACHER.
THE ONLY PROBLEM WAS GETTING THERE BECAUSE WE LIVED ON ASHLEY ROAD AND NOBODY HAD A CAR IN 19 32, 33, 34.
WE DIDN'T HAVE A CAR UNTIL JUST BEFORE THE WAR.
UH, THERE'S A STORY THERE TOO.
BUT, UH, IN ANY CASE, UH, YEAH, WHEN WE WALKED TO SCHOOL, HOW LONG DID IT TAKE YOU TO WALK? UH, I WAS HELD A SPEED RECORD.
I THINK I, I'D SAY, UH, 10 DAYS ON A GOOD 10 MINUTES ON A GOOD DAY, 11 OR 12 MINUTES IF I HAD MY TRUMPET ALONG.
SO WHEN AND WHEN, WHAT DID YOU DO, UH, OR WHAT WAS SCHOOL LIKE, UH, AFTER YOU GOT OUT OF KINDERGARTEN AND WENT INTO THE GRADE SCHOOL? OKAY.
DO YOU REMEMBER WHAT THAT WAS LIKE? WELL, UH, I USED TO KNOW THE NAME OF EVERY ONE OF MY TEACHERS, AND I LIKED THEM ALL.
MISS, MS. TRAVIS WAS MY FAVORITE ONE.
MY SIXTH GRADE TEACHER, SHE GOT ME ORIENTED TOWARDS, UH, HASTINGS HISTORY.
UH, THAT'S NOT BAD, BECAUSE SHE WAS, I THINK, THE MATH TEACHER, AND I LOVE THAT.
SHE GAVE ME A CHALLENGE ONE DAY.
SHE SAID, JOHN, WHEN ARE LEAP YEARS? OKAY, SO HERE I WAS 11 YEARS OLD, AND HOW, HOW DO YOU DETERMINE WHAT YEAR IS IS A LEAP YEAR? AND I DIDN'T KNOW THE ANSWER.
AND HUEY CRACK DIDN'T KNOW THE ANSWER, MY BEST FRIEND.
AND WE WENT THROUGH INTO SEVENTH GRADE, AND I WAS STILL PUZZLING IT OUT.
AND THEN IN EIGHTH GRADE, THE MATH TEACHER SAID, WELL, YOU KNOW, UH, IT, IT'S, UH, IT'S EVERY FOUR YEARS.
SO I RAN TO SEE MS. TRAVIS, AND I SAID, IT'S EVERY FOUR YEARS.
AND SHE SAID, AND, AND, AND, AND I HAD TO THINK, OH, WHEN IT'S DIVISIBLE, IT COMES OUT EVEN.
SO THAT WAS THE SORT OF INFLUENCES WE, WE HAD.
UH, I LOVED THE FIFTH GRADE TEACHER TOO.
UM, WE HAD TO LINE UP IN ORDER TO GO TO THE BATHROOM.
AND, UH, I TENDED TO BE AT THE HEAD OF THE LINE.
I DIDN'T END UP BY THE TALLEST ONE IN THE CLASS, BY ANY MEANS.
YOU BE CRI AND JIMMY DWYER BEAT ME EVENTUALLY.
UH, WE WERE VERY PROUD OF THE SCHOOL SYSTEM BE WELL, THAT, THAT'S WHAT WE GOT TO THE HIGH SCHOOL.
WHAT WAS HIGH SCHOOL LIKE? UH, HIGH HIGH SCHOOL WAS INVOLVED WITH A SCHOOL ORGANIZATION.
UH, WE'D STARTED IN SEVENTH GRADE.
IN NINTH GRADE, WE'D HAD OUR OWN GRADUATION, BUT I THINK THAT'S ACTUALLY AS EIGHTH GRADE GRADUATION.
BUT AS I RECALL, WE WERE THE FIRST ONES TO HAVE ONE.
THEY ASKED US AS STUDENTS TO DETERMINE WHAT WE WERE GOING TO SAY AND HOW WE WERE GOING TO SAY, AND WHAT, HOW MUCH FOLDER ALL THERE WOULD BE ON TOP OF THAT.
SO, UH, ONCE WE GOT INTO THERE, THERE WERE THE SPORTS TEAMS. UH, THERE WAS A BAND.
MUSIC WAS A BIG DEAL, ESPECIALLY IN MY LIFE.
UH, ABOUT THE TIME I GOT INTO NINTH GRADE, THEY HIRED A, A, A NEW MUSIC TEACHER.
AND EVERYTHING ELSE I WAS, UH, DOING AFTER THAT.
UH, UH, SO WE JOINED THE CHORUS.
WE HAD, UH, BAND ON MONDAY, WEDNESDAY, FRIDAYS, ON THE ORCHESTRA ON TUESDAY AND THURSDAYS BEFORE SCHOOL.
SO THAT, THAT WAS HOW I WAS TIMING
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MYSELF, BECAUSE I WOULD BRING MY TRT HOME AND PRACTICE FOR A HALF AN HOUR IN MY, IN MY BEDROOM.AND WE GOT, UH, MORE SERIOUS AND MORE SERIOUS ABOUT IT ALL.
MR. MARSH, THE THE CONDUCTOR WAS A BIG SINGER IN NEW YORK CITY.
HE SANG AS A DOUBLE BASS WITH ROBERT SHAW, WHO WAS EVENTUALLY, HE HAD A GROUP CALLED THE COLLEGIATE CORRAL, WHICH WAS A, HAD ESTABLISHED ITSELF.
HE EVENTUALLY MOVED SOUTH, BUT HE EVEN INVITED HUBBERT KRAKEN, ME AS TENORS TO COME AND SING WITH THEM ON TUESDAY NIGHTS, UH, FOR THE REHEARSALS.
EVERY WEEK WE DECIDED WE'D RATHER DO OUR HOMEWORK OR STAY AROUND IT.
SO WE NEVER TOOK ADVANTAGE OF IT.
BUT THE, THE THOUGHT THAT HE'D GIVEN US STUCK WITH ME, AND WELL, THE BAND BECAME IMPORTANT.
WE ALWAYS PLAYED FOR THE HOME FOOTBALL GAMES.
AND WE ALWAYS MARCH ON THE 4TH OF JULY.
AND ON MEMORIAL DAY AND MAYBE, UH, ON, UH, NOVEMBER 11TH FOR WHAT WE CALL VETERAN DAY TODAY.
DEFINITELY DID IT UP AND DOWN WAR AVENUE AND BACK.
SO THERE WERE PARADES ON EACH OF THOSE DAYS? YES.
AND BIG SPEECHES AT THIS MUNICIPAL BUILDING.
UH, BACK HERE, THERE WAS SOMEBODY NAMED WILLIAM WILLIAMS, OR JOHN JOHNSON, I THINK IT WAS WILLIAM WILLIAMS WAS A BIG SPEAKER IN MY EARLY YEARS.
HERE'S ANOTHER THING WHERE MUSIC AND EVERYTHING BECAME PART OF MY LIFE.
UH, WE, WE WERE THE CLASS THAT WAS TOO YOUNG TO GO OFF TO WORLD WAR II, BUT WE WERE OLD ENOUGH TO GET INVOLVED WITH IT.
I WAS, UH, A MESSENGER WHENEVER WE HAD BLACKOUTS, I GOT TO RIDE MY BIKE AROUND IN THE DARK AND REPORT BACK THAT SOMEBODY HAD A CURTAIN THAT WASN'T PULLED ALL THE WAY OVER, AND WE COULD SEND A WARDEN OVER TO TELL THEM TO CLOSE IT UP.
THAT OUR CLASS WAS THE REAL FIRST CLASS POST-WAR.
BUT A LOT OF THEM WERE BOYS WHO HAD BEEN DRAFTED, HAD BEEN IN THERE.
SO THEY GAVE A DIFFERENT CHARACTER TO THAT CLASS.
THEY DIDN'T GET THE SAME SCHOOL SPIRIT WE WERE MANAGING TO DO IN THE CLASS OF 47.
UM, WELL, I, I BROUGHT WITH ME, THIS WAS SURPRISE OR SURPRISE, OUR YEAR YEARBOOK, OUR ANNUAL YEAR, WHICH WAS CALLED THE YELLOW JACKET.
WE WERE THE CLASS THAT HAD TO DECIDE WHAT THE NAME WOULD BE, AND WE DECIDED ON THE YELLOW JACKET.
AND YELLOW IS PART OF SCHOOL COLORS.
HOW, HOW DID YOU COME WITH THAT NAME? HOW WAS THAT NAME CREATED? UH, UH, I THINK WE, WE WERE TOLD THAT MAYBE WE HAD THE COLORS GREEN AND GOLD, AND MAYBE THE, OUR ADVISOR SAID, YELLOW SOUNDS LIKE A BEE.
AND, UH, COULD YOU THINK OF A NAME FOR YOURSELVES WITH IT? I, I, WE DIDN'T WANNA BE LIONS AND TIGERS AND BEARS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO WE DID THIS AND, UH, UH, WE HAD OUR OWN, UH, CLASSMATE WHO DID THE ILLUSTRATIONS ALONG IT.
HERE'S A, HERE'S A PAGE THAT I'D LIKE TO SHOW YOU.
UM, THIS IS A PAGE I HAVE TO TALK ABOUT, UH, 1947.
BUT, BUT ANYWAY, HERE WERE CARTOON-LIKE CHARACTERS AS THERE WERE WHENEVER POSSIBLE, UH, THAT, THAT SYMBOLIZED A HASTINGS HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT.
CAN I TALK ABOUT THIS? OF COURSE.
1947 WAS A RETURN TO NORMALCY HERE.
AND, UH, A NEW YORK NEWSPAPER CALLED THE HERALD TRIBUNE, UH, HAD THE FIRST, IT'S NOT A SCHOOL EXCHANGE, BUT WHAT THEY DID IS THEY INVITED STUDENTS OF THE, OF THE AGE OF HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS TO COME VISIT HASTINGS HIGH SCHOOL IN JANUARY, FEBRUARY AND MARCH OF 1947.
SO THEY CAME FROM AS MANY DIFFERENT COUNTRIES.
THERE WAS AL SEED FROM, FROM QUEBEC, CANADA.
HE WAS FRENCH SPEAKING CANADIAN, BUT BILINGUAL.
UH, THERE WAS, UH, UH, A GIRL FROM COSTA RICA, UH, A BOY, UH, A GIRL FROM ECUADOR, A BOY FROM ARGENTINA.
AND FINALLY THERE WAS A MAURICE.
UM, I GOT, GET HIM THIS RIGHT, UH, MAURICE KIRBY.
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WE SHARED HIM IN OUR HOUSE AND WITH OUR NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE OF JACK LA STORES, THE LEMON STORES TOOK HIM IN.UH, HE RE RE REPRESENTED A, A CHALLENGE TO THE HASTY SCHOOLS BECAUSE HE WAS BLACK BEING, BUT HE WAS ALSO THE SON OF THE PRESIDENT, OR THE VICE OF THE CHAIRMAN OF SOMEBODY IMPORTANT BACK HOME.
AND, UH, WE HAD NO, WE HAD A GREAT TIME WITH HIM.
HE WAS SOPHISTICATED USE TO THIS SORT OF THING HERE.
AND, UH, HASTY SET ITSELF PROUD.
SO THEY WERE THERE TO ATTEND OUR CLASSES.
THEY TOOK 'EM UP TO HYDE PARK, THEY TOOK TO NEW YORK CITY ON SHOPPING TRIPS.
UH, THEY WERE FREE TO GO AND EVERYTHING.
THERE WERE, THERE WERE SIX OF 'EM IN ALL.
AND WE HELD DANCES WITH THEM, AND THEY SHOWED THEMSELVES OFF.
EVENTUALLY, WE, WE HAD A BIG FAREWELL, UH, CEREMONY IN THE HIGH SCHOOL AUDITORIUM, UH, WHICH IS THE SAME AUDITORIUM THAT YOU HAVE TODAY.
AND, UH, WE SAW THEM OFF WITH FULL OF GOODWILL.
AND IT WAS CONTINUED AFTER THAT BY THE HAROLD TRI UNIT, AND PROBABLY, UH, MELDED IN WITH THE, THE, THE FRIENDS SERVICE COMMITTEE PLANS OR THE ROTARY CLUB AT PLANS.
SO, SO, IS THAT, THAT IT SOUNDS LIKE IT WAS SORT OF THE BEGINNING OF, UH, A FS WHERE THERE WERE FOREIGN EXCHANGE STUDENTS COMING TO THE SCHOOL THAT, THAT, THAT CAME, IT, IT REALLY DEVELOPED INTO THAT A A FS WAS RECIPROCAL.
AND WE WOULD TAKE SOMEBODY IN AND SOMEBODY FROM OUR SCHOOL WOULD GO TO A, A DIFFERENT COUNTRY TOO, AS THAT'S ASSOCIATED.
HOW DID YOU GET SELECTED TO MONITOR THE BLACKOUT, UH, IN HASTINGS? WELL, WE HAVE TO TALK ABOUT ASHLEY ROAD
LEMME BACK UP A LITTLE BIT, BECAUSE WHEN, WHEN WE MOVED IN THERE, UH, THERE WERE MORE EMPTY PLOTS THAN THERE WERE HOUSES.
THE HOUSES HAD BUILT, HAD BEEN BUILT BY A DEVELOPER.
THEY HAD OUR HOUSE AND ONE RIGHT NEXT TO US ON ONE SIDE, AN EMPTY LOTTO.
THE OTHER SIDE, THERE WERE THE BUTLERS AND THE TOMANS UP AT THE TOP OF THE HILL, WE HAVE TO TALK ABOUT THAT HILL SPIKE.
THAT HILL WAS THE BEST PLACE TO HAVE A HOUSE ALONG IN THE WINTERS.
WINTERS AT HASTINGS IN THE 1940S WERE SNOW FROM DECEMBER UNTIL MARCH, AND YOU PLAYED FOR MORE SNOW, BECAUSE THAT MADE BETTER SLEDDING.
SO, EXCEPT FOR A FULL ART HILL, AND I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THAT, BUT, OR MOUNT HOPE TOO.
MOUNT HOPE MUST HAVE BEEN GOOD.
BUT THIS ONE HAD A CURVE IN IT.
AND YOU COULD START, UH, TRUDGE ALL THE WAY UP TO THE TOP, GET A RUNNING BELLY FLOP, AND KEEP ON GOING PAST JOE'S HOUSE, OUR HOUSE, BOBBY'S HOUSE, JACK'S HOUSE, ALL THE WAY OUT TO ROGATE ROAD, UH, ON A GOOD DAY.
AND IF YOU, IF IT HAD RAINED AND HAD FROZEN OVER, THAT WAS EVEN BETTER.
THE WORST ENEMY WE WERE WERE THE GARBAGE MEN WHO CAME AROUND WITH THEIR TRASH, WITH THEIR CINDERS, AND, AND THEN THEY WOULD GO UP TO THE TOP AND RUIN IT ALL.
BUT, UH, BUT, BUT WE COLLECTED THEM FOR FAR AND WIDE IN, IN ORDER TO DO, ASHLEY WROTE HIM.
SO HOW DO YOU REMEMBER HOW YOU GOT SELECTED TO RIDE YOUR BIKE AROUND? OH, OH, OKAY.
THE, THE, THE WHOLE THING IS, UH, JOE WAS TOO YOUNG.
UH, AND, UH, JACK HADN'T MOVED IN YET.
UH, THERE WAS A BOY ABOUT TWO, THREE YEARS OLDER, BUT HE, UM, LIVED WITH HIS MOTHER AND, AND DIDN'T MIX WITH MOST OTHER PEOPLE.
AND WHO PICKED YOU TO, TO DO THAT? I BET YOU I VOLUNTEERED SO HARD THAT THEY COULDN'T TURN ME DOWN.
THAT BIKE WAS, UH, UH, THE SOURCE OF ALL SORTS OF POSSIBILITIES.
INSTEAD OF WALKING FOR 10 OR 15 MINUTES IN ORDER TO GET TO ANY MEANINGFUL DESTINATION, I COULD RIDE TO DOBBS FERRY AND BACK PRACTICALLY IN A HALF AN HOUR ANYWAY.
AND I WAS DOING IT ALL THE TIME.
AND THEN YOU, YOU SAID THERE WAS A STORY BEHIND YOU GETTING YOUR FIRST CAR, OR YOUR FAMILY GETTING THE FIRST CAR? UH,
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OUR FIRST CAR, YEAH.NO, YOU KNOW, MY FATHER DIDN'T NEED A, A CAR BECAUSE IN ALL THROUGH THE, UNTIL THE END OF THE WAR, THERE WAS A, THE PUTNAM RAILROAD LINE WAS ITS SERVICE.
SO HE WOULD WALK A QUARTER OF A MILE DOWN TO THE SAWMILL RIVER TO THE STOP THAT THEY HAD, UH, AT, UH, MOUNT HOPE, I THINK THEY CALLED IT.
AND, UH, AND HE WAS ON HIS WAY TO NEW YORK CITY.
AND WHAT DID, WHAT DID HE DO? WHAT KIND OF WORK DID HE DO? MY FATHER WAS IN ADVERTISING ON MADISON AVENUE.
HE, HE HAD, UM, MA UH, MODEST, UH, UH, UH, PORTFOLIOS THAT HE WAS TAKING CARE OF.
THE BIG ONE WAS, UH, AN ASBESTOS MANUFACTURER UNTIL ASBESTOS WAS FOUND TO BE DEADLY
AND SO HE CHANGED TO SOMETHING ELSE HE TELL, CALLED PAINTS.
IN OTHER WORDS, HE, HE KEPT A CAREER THERE, LIVED.
HE WAS A MADMAN, BUT A VERY SENSIBLE MADMAN AND A VERY, LET'S SAY WE SAY NEW ENGLAND OR NEW JERSEY TYPE, UH, METHODIST, UH, A CHURCH GOER.
UH, SO THAT IF ANYBODY GAVE HIM A BOTTLE FOR, FOR HIS, UH, GOOD WORKS DURING THE YEAR, HE WOULD PUT IT IN THE BACK PORCH OR PUT IT IN THE TRASH CAN.
NO, BUT YOU DID GO TO MOVIES, I WOULD ASSUME.
I I CAN NAME ALL THE MOVIES THEY TOOK ME TO.
AND THEN, NO, ACTUALLY, IT WAS NOT REALLY PART OF OUR ROUTINE.
WE, MORE OR LESS THE MCINTYRE STAYED AT HOME, WORRIED ABOUT THE CHURCH.
UH, IT WAS THE DUTCH REFORM CHURCH.
MY FATHER WAS A, A, A DEACON AND THEN AN ELDER, AND THEN AN ELDER EMERITUS.
SO WHEN YOU WERE IN HIGH SCHOOL, WHAT, WHAT DID YOU DO, UH, FOR FUN ASIDE WHEN, ASIDE FROM THE SLEDDING DURING THE WINTER? WELL, WE DID EVERYTHING.
UM, I GOT, I GOT INVOLVED IN, UM, THE GENERAL ORGANIZATION.
I SEEMED, I FOUND MYSELF, UH, APPOINTED TREASURER OF THE GO, UH, BEFORE A, A YEAR BEFORE.
IT WOULD'VE BEEN NORMAL AS A JUNIOR, OR MAYBE EVEN AS A SOPHOMORE.
I WAS THE SCHOOL STUDENT POPULATION TREASURER.
I MEAN, IT, IT WAS A TURNING POINT IN MY LIFE AS A TREASURER.
I FIGURED OUT I'M GOING TO DO SOMETHING THAT DAKOTA REMEMBER ME FOR.
AND I TALKED TO DR. HOPKINS AND, UH, UH, MR. ROSS, THE PRINCIPAL, DR. HOPKINS WAS THE SUPERINTENDENT.
AND I SAID, I'VE GOT A GREAT IDEA.
IF I COULD GET EVERYBODY TO BECOME A GO MEMBER, WOULD YOU GIVE US A DAY OFF FROM SCHOOL
AND THEY REGRETTED THAT BECAUSE I DREAMED UP A CAMPAIGN THAT STARTED OUT WITH A CARTOON CHARACTER THAT I GOT RIGHT FROM THE CARTOONS ON THE, OF THE SHEETS ON THE SUNDAY PAPERS.
DO YOU REMEMBER DICK TRACY? HE HAD A CHARACTER CALLED, UH, BO PLENTY.
AND BO PLENTY WAS, UH, REPREHENSIBLE AND TRAMP AND EVERYTHING ELSE LIKE THAT.
I TURNED HIM INTO GEO PLENTY
IT WAS SEVENTH THROUGH 12TH GRADE, SO WE HAD SIX CLASSES IN THERE.
AND I PRODUCED THE FACT THAT IF THAT'S RIGHT, IF YOU COULD MAKE GEO PLENTY, FILL UP THIS THERMOMETER TO THE TOP, YOU'RE GOING TO GET A TAIL.
AND THEY DID IT EVERY, THEY, EVERY HOMEROOM COLLECTED A QUARTER PER KID.
I DON'T KNOW HOW IT COULD HAVE HAPPENED, BUT IN, IT DIDN'T TAKE VERY LONG.
AND WHAT, WHAT DOES GO STAND FOR THE GENERAL ORGANIZATION NOW? LOTS OF 'EM CALLED THE GA'S AND SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
BUT THEN I WOULDN'T HAVE HAD MY, MY PET CHARACTER
UH, SO ANYWAY, THAT LAUNCHED MY CAREER.
AND, UH, TWO YEARS LATER, I RAN FOR PRESIDENT.
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NOT SURPRISINGLY, SINCE THE SEVENTH, EIGHTH GRADERS KNEW ME SO WELL, THEY WERE NOW NINTH GRADERS AND SEVENTH GRADERS, THEY VOTED ME IN AND I GOT TO DO IT.THAT'S WHY I WAS ABLE TO DO SOMETHING WITH THE, UH, THE LATIN AMERICAN OR THE SOUTH AMERICAN STUDENTS THAT WERE HERE.
WE HAD, WE WERE PLANNING THE THINGS FOR THEM TO DO.
AND I WAS, UH, UH, MASTER CEREMONIES FOR WHATEVER HAPPENED IN THERE.
SO, DID YOU EVER PLAY DOWN BY THE RIVER AT ALL, OR NOT, IS THAT A SONG DOWN BY THE RIVER
UM, WE DID A LOT, UM, UH, UM, YES, WHEN I WAS A SOPHOMORE, I WAS PART, UH, WE HAD YORKIE JANOR, UH, ON SAXOPHONE, ANOTHER SAXOPHONE PLAYER, UH, A PIANO PLAYER AND A DRUMMER AND MYSELF ON THE TRUMPET, FIVE OF US.
AND WE WERE KNOWN AS THE JIVE FIVE, GET IT.
AND WE PLAYED FOR THE SCHOOL DANCES.
AND THEN AT THE END OF THE YEAR, ON JANUARY, THE EVE OF NEW YEAR'S EVE, WE PLAYED FOR THE FIREMEN UP IN UNION TOWN.
WE WERE EVEN THINKING OF GETTING ONTO, UH, A CRUISE BOAT IN THE SUMMER.
THIS IS DURING THE WORLD WAR II.
THERE WERE NO TRUMPET PLAYERS IN SAXOPHONE PLAYERS AVAILABLE OF ANY SORT.
AND WE WERE A BIG HIT THAT WAY.
SO, UH, THAT, THAT WAS A PART OF IT.
UH, WE SANG, UH, MR. MARSH, UH, WAS GREAT AT CORAL, UH, DIRECTING AND SO FORTH.
UH, HE TAUGHT ME HOW TO CONDUCT.
HE TOOK ME UNDER HIS ARM ABOUT EVERYTHING.
HE CALLED ME M VERY, HE STARTED CALLING ME MACK WHEN HE CAME.
AND I WAS A NINTH GRADER OR EIGHTH GRADER, AND EVERYBODY IN THE HIGH SCHOOL CALLED ME MAC.
I WAS NEVER JOHN, NEVER JACK, I WAS ALWAYS MACK.
SO HE SAID, UH, MACK, I WANT TO, I WANT TO TEACH A COURSE IN MUSIC THEORY.
I, I, I'D READ IT ALL I COULD FIND ABOUT MUSIC THEORY ON MY OWN.
AND HE SAID, UH, AND YOU HAVE TO TAKE A REGENTS AT THE END, AND IF YOU TAKE IT, YOU GET FOUR CREDITS FOR IT, BECAUSE IT'S A FOUR YEAR COURSE, BUT WE'LL TEACH IT IN ONE YEAR FOR YOU.
AND IT WAS UP MY SOPHOMORE YEAR, AND SINCE WE WERE NOT TAKING ANY MUSIC OR ART CLASSES ALL YEAR LONG, I HAD TO GIVE UP ANOTHER COURSE, AND I GAVE UP FRENCH.
LITTLE DID I KNOW I WAS GOING TO BECOME A TEACHER OF FRENCH, BUT AT THAT POINT, I GAVE UP THE VERY FOUNDATION OF IT, THE FIRST YEAR IS TO TAKE YOU TO KNOW THE, THE, THE PRESENT TENSE AND MAYBE A LITTLE BIT OF THE PAST TENSE AND THE SECOND TENSE.
YOU GET ALL THE REST OF THE GRAMMAR, AND THERE'S A REGENTS AT THE END OF IT.
SO I DIDN'T TAKE THAT YEAR, AND I DID TAKE THE REGENTS OUT AS IT WAS ALL OVER.
AND WHEN WE WERE THROUGH WITH THE MUSIC THEORY CLASS THAT I GOT A HUNDRED.
UM, BUT I PROBABLY WASN'T THE ONLY ONE, UH, IN ANY CASE, UH, I INSISTED THAT I GET PUT BACK IN WITH MY CLASSMATES THAT I'D HAD FOR FRESHMAN YEAR.
AND WE HAD A NEW FRENCH TEACHER, THE FAMOUS MADAM GESSLER, WHO LIVED UP AT THE TOP OF MOUNT HILL BOULEVARD, AND WHO I ADMIRED ALL MY LIFE, UH, UH, SHE SAW ME INTO BEING A, UH, A PRACTICE STUDENT TEACHER IN HASTINGS HIGH SCHOOL.
AND, UH, AND THEN SHE FOLLOWED ME AFTER THAT.
AND WE USED TO GET INTO OUR HOUSE UP THERE AND JUST SING FRENCH SONGS AND EVERYTHING LIKE THAT.
LITTLE DID I KNOW HOW MUCH I WAS GOING TO USE THEM LATER IN LIFE.
SO WHEN DID YOU BECOME A FRENCH TEACHER? AND WHERE I BECAME A FRENCH TEACHER IN FRANCE.
AND THAT WAY, IN THAT SENSE, UM, I, I DID NOT DO WELL IN FRENCH AND COLLEGE.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, I DROPPED THE COURSE AND SWITCHED TO MUSIC FOR MY SECOND SEMESTER OF FOUR YEARS, AND I CONCENTRATED FOR MUSIC.
MY LANGUAGE ADVISOR SAID, WELL, MUSIC IS THE LANGUAGE OF LOVE.
WE'LL, WE'LL, WE'LL TOLERATE THAT.
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PUT ON FRENCH ASSEMBLIES WHERE ALL THE KIDS, UH, THE SEVENTH AND EIGHTH, UH, GRADERS WHO WERE NOT EVEN STUDYING A FOREIGN LANGUAGE.AND THE NINTH, 10TH, 11TH, AND 12TH, WHO MAYBE WERE STUDYING SPANISH AND NOT FRENCH, WE WOULD STILL PUT ON A SHOW AND, UH, AND MAKE FUN ABOUT AMERICAN TOURS.
WHO COULD, COULDN'T PRO PRONOUNCE FRENCH.
THEY WOULD CALL FOR THE WAITER IN PARIS ON THE SCH SAYING, GARCO GARCO.
UH, SO, UH, WHERE AM I GOING WITH IT? SO WHERE, WHERE WERE YOU IN, UH, COLLEGE? WHERE DID YOU GO TO SCHOOL? IN COLLEGE? OH, I WENT TO SWARTHMORE.
SWARTHMORE COLLEGE IS A GREAT FORM THAT TAUGHT ME SO MUCH THAT I LEARNED A LOT ABOUT THE WORLD AND ABOUT, UM, BEING HUMAN AND HUMANITARIAN AND, AND TAKING CARE OF EVERYBODY AND FROM THE QUAKER SPHERE THAT THEY HAD THERE.
SO WHERE, WHERE DID YOU TEACH? I MEAN, WHAT WAS, WHERE DID YOU TEACH? OH, I, I, WELL, LE LET'S HAPPEN.
UH, FORTUNATELY I WAS SENT TO EUROPE AT THE TIME OF THE KOREAN WAR.
THAT NOT ONLY CHANGED MY LIFE, PROBABLY SAVED MY LIFE.
BY THAT TIME, I WAS A COMMISSIONED OFFICER IN THE ARTILLERY AND COMMISSIONED OFFICERS.
AND THE ARTILLERY HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR DIRECTING FIRE OF THE GUNS, OF THE, UH, THE HOWITZERS FROM SOME HIGH POINT, LIKE AT THE TOP OF A BELL TOWER OR THE TOP OF A HILL WHERE YOU ARE ACE DUCK FOR THE ENEMY.
BUT, SO IN, IN ANY CASE, I GOT, UH, I, I SURVIVED, UH, THAT YEAR THERE.
AND I HAD SEVERAL FRIENDS IN EUROPE.
I DIDN'T WANT TO GIVE UP, AND I HADN'T REALLY PRACTICED MY FRENCH.
SO I LOOKED FOR A CHANCE TO STAY ON.
I REFUSED TO BE SHIPPED HOME, KEPT MY CAR, GOT MY MUSTERING OUT, PAY, HAD A GOOD TIME, AND FOUND A JOB THAT TOOK ME TO FRANCE.
AND THE, THE ONLY JOKER TO IT WAS MY EMPLOYER WAS THE SAME AS THE ONE I'D HAD FOR THREE YEARS BEFORE IT WAS UNCLE SAM.
BUT I WAS HIRED AS A CIVILIAN.
AND I PUT IN MY 40, 40 HOURS A WEEK, AND I IMMEDIATELY MADE FRIENDS, A GIRLFRIEND, AND, UH, GOT WELL KNOWN.
UH, I WAS LEARNING FRENCH THE WAY YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DO IT, VOYAGE, UH, GOING TO THE MO, MICHELLE, GOING TO BRITTANY, AND SO FORTH.
I HAD A FRIEND OR TWO WHO WERE IN UNIFORM, BUT, UH, THEY, ONE WAS MARRIED.
AND THE, AND THE THREE OF US AND MY FRENCH GIRLFRIEND, UH, UH, SPENT A YEAR AND A HALF, VERY WELL THAT WAY.
AND EVENTUALLY AFTER I MOVED TO ANOTHER TOWN WHERE, UH, IT WAS IN THE EAST OF FRANCE AND IT HAD WORLD WAR I MEMORIES, IT WAS THE CITY OF VER DUN, THE AMERICAN.
WE HAD, UH, UH, UH, CASSER OF, UH, PEOPLE HAD THE, UH, SUPPLIES THERE, AND WE HAD TO HIRE CIVILIANS FROM THE POPULATION TO WORK FOR UNCLE SAM.
THEY DIDN'T SPEAK ENGLISH, AND THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE OF OUR RADIO OR TYPEWRITERS AND WHATEVER SYSTEMS THAT THEY WERE EXPECTED TO KNOW.
SO I WAS PUT IN CHARGE OF HELPING THEM TO ADJUST TO WORKING WITH US.
AND I CAME UP WITH THE IDEA WITH A LITTLE HELP FROM, UH, UH, UH, UH, AN AIDE WHO CAME FROM THE FRENCH MILITARY INTO MY, THE CAPTAIN WHO WAS MY BOSS.
AND HE GOT GO ALONG, WENT ALONG WITH THE IDEA OF SETTING UP AN ENGLISH LANGUAGE COURSE EVENINGS IN THE HIGH SCHOOL IN THE
AND, UH, I WOULD TEACH THEM THE BEST I COULD, MY ENGLISH, WITH MY LIMITED FRENCH.
AND THE FIRST NIGHT WE GOT 300 PEOPLE WHO SHOWED UP BIGGER THAN ANY ROOM EXCEPT FOR THE AUDITORIUM.
AND THAT, THAT DWINDLED DOWN QUICKLY, ESPECIALLY WHEN THE, THE ENGLISH TEACHER FROM THE
HE WAS ONE, DID WANNA HAVE AN AMERICAN ACCENT AMONG HIS STUDENTS.
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AND IN THE END, WE, WE TAUGHT THAT WE GRADUATED THEM.AND, AND WE, WE FELT THAT, UH, ARMY CIVILIAN FRENCH AMERICAN, UH, RELATIONS WERE IMPROVED THAT WAY.
AND IT WAS MY FIRST JOB TEACHING.
AND BY THAT TIME, I WAS TEACHING ENGLISH TO FRENCH PEOPLE ON THE BOAT COMING HOME, BECAUSE UNCLE SAM SAID, ENOUGH, ENOUGH.
BUSTA MCINTYRE, GET OUT OF HERE.
OR WE'RE NOT EVEN GOING TO PAY FOR YOU TO GO HOME.
SO I LEFT ON A SHIP, AND I, AND IT WASN'T UNTIL I WAS IN, WITHIN SIGHT OF THE STATUE OF LIBERTY, THAT I SUDDENLY REALIZED I COULD TEACH FRENCH.
I JUST HAD TO GO, UH, TAKE A YEAR TO GO TO SCHOOL, UH, TO LEARN THE METHODS OF TEACHING AND COLLEGE TEACHERS COLLEGE IN NEW YORK.
AND, UH, AND, UH, SOME OTHER THINGS, UH, TO MAKE SURE I HAD ENOUGH CREDIT CREDENTIALS IN STUDYING FRENCH.
SINCE I MAY HAVE MENTIONED THAT I ONLY HAD THAT FIRST COURSE AND DIDN'T DO WELL IN IT AT ALL.
I HAD A GOT GOT ALONG WITH THAT.
BUT THEN I, I WAS SPEAKING CONTEMPORARY SLANG AND EASY TO SAY EXPRESSIONS.
WHEN THEY SENT SOMEBODY IN TO EXAMINE MY FRENCH, THEY APOLOGIZED FOR THE FACT THAT THEY HADN'T BEEN BACK TO FRANCE FOR 20 YEARS.
AND SO WHEN I EXCUSED THEM, SO I CAME BACK AND, UH, WITH TEACHERS COLLEGE, I HAD MY YEAR, I HAD TO BEGIN TO PRACTICE TEACHING.
I CAME BACK TO HASTINGS HIGH SCHOOL WITH THE SAME TEACHERS THERE WITH, UM, MRS. PING TEACHING HISTORY COURSES.
I DON'T KNOW IF PEOPLE EVER TALK ABOUT HER, BUT SHE WAS THE BEST TEACHER, TEACHER I EVER HAD AS SHE TAUGHT NINTH, NINTH GRADE HISTORY.
UH, AND I REMEMBERED HER TECHNIQUES FOR THAT.
THE FRENCH TEACHER WAS NOT THERE WHEN I WAS THERE.
SHE LET ME TEACH MOST OF HER CLASSES.
ANYWAY, UH, WE HAD A WONDERFUL STUDENTS IN MY CLASS THERE.
IN THE SENIOR CLASS, I HAD A, A, A STUDENT WHO WAS SO SOPHISTICATED WHO KNEW ALL ABOUT FRIENDS.
AND SHE WAS THE DAUGHTER, I'M, EXCUSE ME, SPIKE.
I'M NOT GOING TO COME UP WITH A FAMILY, BUT IT'S THE FAMILY WHO, THE TWO DOCTORS WHOSE NAMES HAVE BEEN HONORED RECENTLY.
OH, KENNETH CLARK AND THE, THE CLARKS, THEIR DAUGHTER, SUCH A WONDERFUL STUDENT.
SHE WAS, THAT, THAT SHE COULD UNDERSTAND ABOUT, ABOUT FRANCE AND SO FORTH.
I REMEMBER HER PARTICULARLY, AND WHAT A CHANGED FOR HASTINGS AND WHAT A CHANGED FOR THE, THE, THIS PERSON WHO WAS LEARNING ABOUT TEACHING.
IT WAS A WONDERFUL EXPERIENCE.
AND THEN, UH, MADAME GESSLER WAS STILL TEACHING THERE.
I, I APPLIED FOR A TEACHING POSITION IN FRENCH.
AND ACTUALLY, THEY WERE NOT, THEY WERE NOT OPEN ANYWHERE.
I, I WENT TO YONKERS TO, UM, NEW ROCHELLE, UM, FOUR OR FIVE INTERVIEWS.
THEY SAID, WE'D LIKE, LIKE TO HAVE YOU COME, BUT WE DON'T HAVE A PLACE FOR YOU.
SO FINALLY, MA MA SAID, WOULD YOU TEACH ANOTHER COURSE INSTEAD? WOULD YOU TEACH SPANISH? I SAID, NO, WOULD YOU TEACH ENGLISH? I SAID, HMM, YES, I COULD TEACH ENGLISH.
SO I WAS TEACHING, UH, THE ALL NINTH GRADERS FOR MY FIRST YEAR OF TEACHING.
ONE OF THE, THE, THE HIRING WENT ON, AND I STUDIED THERE FOR 33 YEARS AFTER THAT, AFTER THREE YEARS, I WAS SWITCHED OVER TO ALL FRENCH.
BUT MUSIC HAS CONTINUED TO PLAY A BIG PART IN YOUR LIFE.
ALONG WITH THE, THE, UH, TEACHING OF FRENCH.
CAN YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT, WHAT YOU DID WITH YOUR INTEREST IN TALENTS AND MUSIC? THANK YOU,
I COULD RUN WITH THAT BALL FOR AT LEAST 50 YARDS.
UH, YEAH, MUSIC HAS ALWAYS BEEN THE THING.
UM, UH, I WOULD, UM, ACCOMPANY MY STUDENTS AND SINGING IN THE MAES THAT WE DO OTHER THINGS, UH, IN THE ARMY, I WOULD PLAY, UH, ON THE TROOPSHIP GOING OVER, EVEN THOUGH I WAS AN OFFICER, THERE WERE 1500 NON OFFICERS THERE AS WELL.
UH, I WOULD TURN OUT TO BE THE ENTERTAINMENT, PLAYING THE PIANO AND LEADING THE SINGING, AND I'M STILL DOING THAT.
AND IN THE OSBORNE HOME, I, I CONDUCT SINGALONGS, UH, NINE OR
[00:35:01]
10 TIMES EVERY YEAR, UH, ON A MONTHLY BASIS.SO, UH, THAT WAS THE, IT WAS THROUGH SINGING THANKS TO HOWARD MARSH THAT, UH, I MADE A PART OF IT.
UH, IT'S A KEYBOARD WHICH CAN, UH, YOU CAN CHANGE THE PITCH OF IT SO I COULD ADJUST MY ACCOMPANIMENT TO YOU IN ANY KEY.
YOU WANT TO SING GOODNIGHT LADIES, AND, UH, I CAN DO IT AT THE 11 DIFFERENT TRACK KEYS.
OH, IN COLLEGE, UM, I BECAME THE MUSIC DIRECTOR FOR THE SCHOOL STUDENT PRODUCTIONS.
AND, UH, IT SEEMED LIKE THE WHOLE YEAR REVOLVED AROUND PUTTING ON OUR SHOW, WHICH WAS CALLED THE HAMBURG SHOW.
POOF IS A SPECIAL NAME FOR LEYS.
THE HAMBURG SHOW GETS EVERYBODY GOING, OH, WE'RE GOING TO THE HAMBURG SHOW, SEE THE LION AND THE WILD KANGAROO, AND WE'LL ALL STICK TOGETHER AND RAIN A SUNNY WEATHER FOR, WE'RE GOING TO SEE THE SHOW.
WE ENDED UP WITH A TWO, TWO ACT STORY OF AN AMERICAN GETTING LOST IN, IN, IN A GERMAN SPEAKING COUNTRY, FALLING IN LOVE WITH A BERGE DAUGHTER, AND, UH, HAVING A LOVE AFFAIR, WHICH WAS FAIR WOOTEN FOR THE PEOPLE AROUND THERE, THEY HAVE TO RUN AWAY.
IF THAT SOUNDS A LITTLE BIT LIKE BRIGADOON
BUT WE WROTE SOME VERY GOOD LOVE SONGS AND COMEDY SONGS.
DADDY KNOWS BEST AND SO FORTH.
AND, UH, THEY NEVER DID THEM AFTER OUR CLASS GRADUATED.
THEY WENT BACK TO INDIVIDUALS DOING THEIR OWN JOKES WITH THEIR OWN GUITARS.
SWARTHMORE PRODUCED PDQ BACH AS A RESULT OF THAT, AS A PRETTY GOOD ENTERTAINER TOO.
SO I, AND THEN AFTER COLLEGE, UH, YOU STILL CONTINUED TO HAVE, DO MUSIC, UH, EVENTS AND, UH, I THINK RELATIVELY RECENTLY, YOU STILL, YOU WENT OVER TO FRANCE TO WORK WITH THE WELL, WE GROUP, WE HAVE TAKEN THE WESTCHESTER CORAL SOCIETY, UH, AND THE G GREENWICH CORAL SOCIETY TO FRANCE, A TOTAL OF FIVE DIFFERENT TIMES.
AND I HELPED THEM BECAUSE I WAS A, I WAS NOT THEIR CONDUCTOR, BUT I WAS, UH, UH, HELPING THE MAN WHO WAS CONDUCTING.
WE GOT, UH, TO SING FOR HIGH MASS IN JULY IN NOTRE DAME CATHEDRAL.
WE ALSO SANG IN SHORT CATHEDRAL OUT OF TOWN EACH TIME EVENT, AND THEN THEY WOULD, UH, GO ON TOUR TO OTHER CITIES AS WELL.
AND THEN AFTER THAT, MY WIFE AND I, WE WOULD, UH, TAKE ANY SINGERS WHO WANTED TO FOR ANOTHER TOUR OF SOME PART OF FRANCE, AND THAT WAS MORE FUN THAN COULD POSSIBLY BE BECAUSE THEY WERE SINGERS.
UH, SO DID, DID YOU, CAN YOU COMMENT ON THE ACOUSTICS OF NOTRE DAME AND, AND AS CONTRAST TO SHARK? WERE THEY THE SAME, OR WAS ONE BETTER THAN THE OTHER?
HOW DO YOU IMPROVE ON A HUNDRED PERCENT? UH, THE, THE, THE TWO MOST BEAUTIFUL CATHEDRALS YOU EVER HAD, SHAR WAS THE BIGGER THE ONE TO SING WITH.
IT'S SMALLER, EQUALLY HISTORIC, IF NOT MORE.
IT MAY HAVE BEEN THERE OUT OF THE GROUND BEFORE THAT.
IN ANY CASE, UM, THE CHORUS ALWAYS SINGS AT THE EAST END, WHERE THE ALTAR IS IN A CATHEDRAL, AND YOU ARE LOOKING OUT THE ROSE WINDOW FACING YOU.
AND AS WE WOULD, UH, IN THE SUMMERTIME AS WHEN WE WERE TRAVELING, OF COURSE IT WAS JULY, THE SUN WOULD SET IN, IN FRANCE, AROUND HALFWAY THROUGH OUR CONCERT.
AND SO YOU'D SEE THE WINDOWS, THE LIGHTS GO DOWN, AND THE, THE, THE, IT BECOMES DARK INSIDE.
AND WHEN YOU STEPPED OUTSIDE, THE STREET LIGHTS WERE ALL IN.
THE SKIES WERE CLEAR OVERHEAD.
IT WAS, UH, AN EMOTIONAL, UH, PURPOSE.
IT A NOTRE DAME DERI, AND YOU CAN'T, YOU CAN'T BEAT IT.
[00:40:01]
YOU KNOW, I SHOULD BE TELLING YOU SOMETHING ABOUT THE FACT THAT, UM, MY HIGH SCHOOL GRANTED SABBATICAL LEAVES, AND THEY GAVE YOU THREE QUARTERS PAY IF YOU STUDIED DURING THAT YEAR.AND IT JUST SO WORKED OUT THAT I HAD EVERYTHING IN FOR A MASTER'S DEGREE IN THE FRENCH LANGUAGE FROM MIDDLEBURY.
BUT I WAS LACKING A YEAR OF STUDY IN PARIS.
YOU HAD TO ATTEND SCHOOL IN PARIS FOR 12, FOR TWO SEMESTERS.
SO I WAS GIVEN THAT, BUT IT MEANT TAKING MY WIFE AND OUR SMALL FAMILY.
OUR YOUNGEST CHILD TURNED ONE ON THE DAY.
WE GOT ON THE BOAT TO GO TO FRANCE.
WE FOUND A HOUSE OUTSIDE OF TOWN, JUST ABOUT THE SAME DISTANCE AND DIRECTION AS HASTINGS IS TO GRAND CENTRAL STATION.
WE WERE THERE FROM PARIS', GOD
AND I ATTENDED MY CLASSES FIVE DAYS A WEEK.
AND THE KIDS, THE TWO OLDER ONES WENT TO SCHOOL IN THE
AND THE YOUNGEST CHILD JUST WATCHED EVERYBODY SPEAKING ONE LANGUAGE THAT SHE KNEW, AND ANOTHER LANGUAGE THAT SHE HAD NOTHING TO DO.
AND IT WASN'T UNTIL WE'D BEEN THERE HALF A YEAR AND FINALLY HAD, UH, THE LADY ACROSS THE STREET SAID, I'LL TAKE CARE OF YOUR DAUGHTER, AND YOU GO OFF AND TAKE, UH, AND HAVE SOME FUN WITH YOUR OTHER CHILDREN.
AND WE CAME BACK AND SHE SAID, YOUR DAUGHTER IS SO INTELLIGENT.
I SAID, WELL, WE SUSPECT THAT, BUT WE, HOW DO YOU KNOW? SHE SAYS, SHE'S SPEAKING TO ME ALL THE TIME.
I SAID, HOW COULD SHE BE SPEAKING TO YOU? YOU DON'T KNOW ENGLISH.
WASN'T THAT A STUPID THING FOR A FOREIGN LANGUAGE TEACHER TO SAY? SHE SAID, JUST LISTEN TO HER.
WE GO OVER THERE AND THERE'S JENNY IN, IN THERE.
AND, UH, SHE SAID, WHAT DO YOU HEAR OUTSIDE THE, THE WINDOW? A CAR WENT BY.
AND JENNY WOULD SAY, AND SHE, MADAM JUSTINE SAID, YOU SEE, SHE SAID, THERE'S A CAR,
IT COULD HAVE BEEN ANYTHING WE WANTED TO BE.
SHE COULD HAVE BEEN SAYING, MOMMY OR GRANDMA, OR GET ME MILK.
OF COURSE, IT'S UP TO THE LISTENER TO SAY WHAT SHE SAID AND SO FORTH.
WELL, FROM THEN ON, IT WAS JUST GREAT.
THE KIDS, UM, SPOKE MORE AND MORE FRENCH EVERY, EVERY, EVERY WEEK.
AND THERE WAS ONE WEEK IN, UH, THE MIDDLE AND PROBABLY EASTER TIME WHERE SCHOOL WAS CANCELED FOR A WEEK.
AND MARIE AND I, MY WIFE, SAID, LET'S JUST SPEAK FRENCH ALL DAY.
AND WHEN THAT WEEK WAS OVER, THE KIDS HAD SWITCHED TO FRENCH AND THEY FORGOT THEIR ENGLISH AND REFUSED TO REMEMBER IT.
WE CAME BACK IN THE FIRST WEEK IN SEPTEMBER.
THE, THE TWO KIDS WERE IMMEDIATELY PUT INTO SCHOOL.
WE THOUGHT THEY'RE GONNA HAVE SUCH A GOOD TIME.
THE TEACHER FOR THE OLDER ONE, ANN MARIE, WHO WAS IN FIRST GRADE, CALLED US AND SHE SAID, SHE'S A LOVELY GIRL.
SHE DRAWS VERY WELL, BUT SHE'S NOT LEARNING HOW TO READ.
WE SAID SHE KNOWS HOW TO READ.
SHE KNOWS THE FRENCH ALPHABET.
AND IN HER CLASS, THEY WERE WRITING A, A DIARY ON THE BOARD.
AFTER EVERY CLASS, THEY WERE ALL READING AND WRITING.
AND THEN WE REALIZED THAT ANNE-MARIE WAS USING THE PHONICS SYSTEM OF THE FRENCH LANGUAGE.
YOU KNOW, HOW YOU SAY A IS FOR APPLE, B'S FOR BANANA.
WELL, JUST LOOK AT THIS SPIKE.
THE LETTERS F AND G STAND FOR FISH AND GOOSE IN ENGLISH, BUT THEY STAND FOR GIRL.
AND BOY, THE TROUBLE IS THE WORD THAT BEGINS WITH GIRL, WITH G IS THE BOY.
AND THE WORLD THAT STANDS FOR A GIRL BEGINS WITH F.
SO EVERYTHING IN HER MIND WAS TOTALLY SCRAMBLED UP WHEN WE TOLD HER ALL ABOUT IT, IT DIDN'T TAKE LONG FOR HER TO CATCH
[00:45:01]
UP.AND BY, UH, WE, WE HAD TO CALL 'EM TO COME DOWN,
AND THEY WOULD COME IF WE SAID, HEY, KIDS SUPPER'S ON THE SOUP'S ON OR SOMETHING, THEY'D PRETEND THEY DIDN'T HEAR US
BUT ON
UH, THEY WA THEY KNEW ALL ABOUT IT.
THEY KNEW THAT IN FRANCE, WE WERE THE ONLY ONES THAT DID IT.
THEY GOT A COSTUME, INVITED EVERYBODY.
UH, BUT THEY FINALLY SAID, WE DON'T KNOW TO THEMSELVES.
WE DON'T KNOW HOW TO SAY TRICK OR TREAT IN FRENCH, BECAUSE THE FRENCH NEVER PLAYED HALLOWEEN.
THE BOTTOM FELL OUT OF, UH, OF THE WHOLE JAR OF, UH, GOODIES THERE.
AND THEY WERE BILINGUAL BACK AGAIN.
HOW DID YOU MEET MARIE? UH, IT WAS ON A BLIND DATE.
UH, IN A WAY, MUSIC GOT ME TOGETHER.
UH, MY BEST FRIEND FROM SWARTHMORE, UH, WAS WORKING IN A PLACE, UH, IN PRINCETON, NEW JERSEY.
AND, UH, I WOULD GO DOWN AND SING AND SUMMER SINGS OR WEEKLY WITH THE LOVERS OF MUSIC OF, OF PRINCETON UNIVERSITY.
WE DID ALL THE GREAT WARHORSES OF
AND, UH, HIS WIFE, WHO WAS ALSO A CLASSMATE OF MINE, HE MARRIED A GIRL FROM SWARTHMORE, SAID, YOU KNOW, YOU'VE GOTTA DO GET JOHN MCINTYRE A A DATE THERE, BECAUSE I'M TIRED OF BEING THE ONE GIRL FOR YOU TWO BOYS.
SO JOHN, MY, HE WAS GOING TO BECOME MY BEST FRIEND.
WELL, JOHN NUMBER TWO SAID, UH, THERE'S THIS GIRL I WAS REALLY INTERESTED IN, BUT YOU TOLD ME NOT TO BOTHER DATING HER BECAUSE SHE WASN'T, SHE WAS CATHOLIC.
I DON'T THINK I EVER REALLY SAID, UH, THAT TO HIM.
BUT IN ANY CASE, HE HAD NOT MARRIED HER, BUT, OR, OR EVEN DATED HER.
SO HE SET US UP, AND I WAS A BEGINNING TEACHER IN MY, UH, TENURE YEAR.
AND, UH, I WAS SET TO GO DOWN FOR, UH, FRIDAY, SATURDAY AND SUNDAY DOWN THERE.
AND I SAID, UH, MY GRADES ARE DUE, JOHN, LET ME GET OUT OF IT.
AND HE SAID, WHAT HAVE TELL MARIE? AND MARIE MEANWHILE SAID, MY PARENTS WANT ME TO DATE THIS BOY WHO'S STUDYING WITH EINSTEIN IN STOOD FOR ADVANCED STUDIES IN PRINCETON, AND SHE WANTED TO GET OUT OF IT.
UH, UH, UH, UH, WASN'T INTERESTED IN THE DATE WITH ME AND JOHN, MY FUTURE BEST MAN.
AND SHE SAID BY SAYING, WHAT AM I GOING TO TELL JOHN? THE SAME STORY SHE HE GAVE HER? AND SO WE MET ON A BLIND DATE, AND WE WENT AND WE SANG, UH, SOMETHING OF, UH, EARLY ENGLISH, UM, MUSIC, AND WE HAD TO GO TO SEPARATE SECTIONS IN THE ROOM IN MS. FINE'S STUDIO THERE, BECAUSE SHE WAS A SOPRANO, AND WE WERE TENORS.
AND, UH, WE ONLY SAW EACH OTHER WHEN WE STARTED, GOT TOGETHER TO HAVE A, A MEAL, UH, TO EAT THE SPAGHETTI AND, AND MEATBALLS IN BETWEEN.
AND I TOOK HER HOME AND I JUST FELL IN LOVE WITH HER.
SHE WAS ENTERTAINING ME WITH STORIES ABOUT HER LITTLE KIDS IN HER LIFE.
SHE WAS A SINGLE GIRL, BUT SHE WAS AN AUNT TO TWO LITTLE GIRLS.
AND SHE DELIGHTED ME WITH THOSE STORIES.
I GOT MY GOOD NIGHT'S KISS, AND I, UH, I SAID,
AND, UH, WE HAD TO WAIT A COUPLE WEEKS BEFORE I COULD GET BACK DOWN.
AND, UH, I ASKED HER TO MARRY ME ON THAT SECOND DATE.
AND I BROUGHT A RING DOWN ON THE THIRD DATE, AND WE KEPT IT UP SEEING EACH OTHER ON SATURDAYS AND SUNDAYS UNTIL THE SCHOOL YEAR ENDED.
NO, I HAD AN ASSIGNMENT THAT STARTED THE DAY SCHOOL ENDED UP IN COLGATE UNIVERSITY, LEARNING NEW METHODS OF TEACHING FOREIGN LANGUAGES SO THAT AMERICANS COULD CATCH UP WITH THE RUSSIANS IN THE BIG SPUTNIK, UH, EDUCATIONAL CAMPAIGN.
AND SO WHEN WE FINALLY GOT MARRIED AT THE END OF AUGUST,
[00:50:01]
WE, ASIDE FROM THE LAST WEEK, JUST BEFORE THE WEDDING, WE'D NEVER SEEN EACH OTHER ON A TUESDAY OR A WEDNESDAY OR A THURSDAY.AND WE WERE GOING FOR A BROKE.
AND THE PRINCIPALS, UH, SECRETARY TOLD ME I SHOULD REALLY NOT RUSH INTO IT,
AND, AND ALL OF MARIE'S FRIENDS WERE SAYING, UH, ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO DO IT? THE ONLY PERSON WHO WAS THOROUGHLY IN CHARGE WITH IT, IN FAVOR OF IT WAS MAURICE'S MOTHER.
AND SHE WAS WINNING HER HEART HER WAY INTO MY HEART, THROUGH MY STOMACH, BY FEEDING ME GREAT ITALIAN COOKIE EVERY TIME I CAME DOWN TO SEE HER.
AND YES, WE GOT, OH, IT, IT, IT ALL HAPPENED IN A FLASH BETWEEN APRIL AND AUGUST.
AND WERE YOUR PARENTS OKAY WITH YOU MARRYING A CATHOLIC? THEY WERE.
THEY SURE WERE AFTER I BROUGHT MARIE HOME TO MEET THEM, YES.
SO, AND HOW MANY YEARS HAVE YOU BEEN MARRIED? UH, WE HAVE ANOTHER MONTH AND A HALF TO GO, AND THAT'LL BE 66.
WE WERE MARRIED IN 1960, SO IT'LL PROBABLY LAST.
SO I JUST WANNA JUMP BACK TO WHEN YOU WERE IN HIGH SCHOOL.
UH, WHAT KINDS OF THINGS DID YOU DO AFTER SCHOOL? WELL, UH, GROWING UP, UH, IN RAVENSDALE WHERE, UH, THE, THE NEIGHBORS AND WE ALL LIVED THERE, WE COULD GET ENOUGH PEOPLE TOGETHER TO PLAY, UH, BASKETBALL AGAINST AN OLD OAK TREE WITH A BAND.
WE COULD PLAY MARBLES UNDERNEATH IT.
AND I COULD GO DOWN TO THE SANDLOT ALONGSIDE OF THE SAWMILL RIVER PARKWAY, AND WE'D HAVE ENOUGH TO PLAY BASEBALL.
SO THAT WAS THE EASY THING TO DO.
AND I DID A LOT OF STUDYING, AND I WAS PRACTICING A HALF AN HOUR A DAY ON MY TRUMPET.
DID YOU AND YOUR FRIENDS EVER GET IN TROUBLE IN HASTINGS? YEAH, I, I COULDN'T GET INTO TROUBLE.
I HAD A CHARMED LIFE, LIKE THE FACT THAT I ENDED UP BEING THE TREASURER FOR THE GO WITHOUT HAVING AS, AS FAR AS I KNOW OR EVEN RUN FOR IT.
UM, WE HAD THE, THE, THE STUDENTS WHO CAME FROM THE LATIN AMERICAN SCHOOLS, UH, A LOT WAS, UH, BUILT AROUND THE FOOTBALL TEAM AND SCHOOL SPIRIT.
UH, NO, I THINK I WAS PRETTY MUCH OF A, OF A GRIND, ACTUALLY.
I KNOW I FOUND IT EASY TO TAKE TESTS, BUT THEN I, I DID A LOT OF CREATIVE THINGS.
I AS A NINE, AS A 9-YEAR-OLD, I CAME ACROSS IT, I LOOKED FOR IT.
I WROTE A STORY CALLED THE BATTLE OF EDGAR'S LANE FOR MY MS. TRAVIS OR, UH, MISS ILLINOIS.
I'D WRITTEN IT THERE, AND I, I MADE IT.
UH, I, I HAD THE CAFE OWNER, THE RESTAURANT OWNER, AND WE HAD THE EVIL HUSING SOLDIER AND SOLDIER AND SO FORTH.
I WOULD WRITE STORIES FOR THE FUN OF IT.
WERE THERE PLACES THAT YOU HUNG OUT? WERE THERE RESTAURANTS OR, UH, DINERS, OR CAN I TALK ABOUT THE GROWING UP YEARS? WHEN, OF COURSE, WHEN ACTUALLY BEFORE WE HAD A CAR, BEFORE I HAD A BICYCLE, UH, WE WOULD PLAY IN THE WOODS BEHIND OUR HOUSE ON ASHLEY ROAD.
YOU KNOW HOW FARGATE GOES DOWN, AND I'VE FORGOTTEN WHAT IT IS ALONGSIDE THE SAW MILL GOES DOWN THERE, THE LARGE WOODS THERE.
AND SO BOBBY AND CARL AND JOE AND I, AND OUR SISTERS, AND WOULD ALL PLAY HIDE AND SEEK, AND A LOT OF IMAGINARY THINGS THERE WHERE IT WAS A BIG ROCK.
WE CALLED THE PIRATE ROCK, AND WE'D MAKE UP ALL SORTS OF STORIES THERE.
UH, MY MOTHER PAINTED, UH, BUT, UH, SHE WAITED UNTIL I HAD LEFT TO GO TO COLLEGE BEFORE SHE TURNED THE BEDROOM, FACING THOSE WOODS BACK THERE IN ORDER TO PAINT THE FOLIAGE THAT WAS THERE.
AND THERE'S ONE PICTURE OF A, OF A MIDWINTER
[00:55:01]
SCENE WITH NO FOLIAGE AT ALL, SNOW ON THE GROUND AND, AND VARIOUS STONES IN THE HILLS AND THE WALL BETWEEN US.I WAS A PART OF THE, OF THE DEN, THE BOY SCOUTS, UH, THE CUB SCOUTS.
UH, THERE WAS A PERSON WHO PLAYED A VERY BIG PART OF OUR LIFE WHILE WE WERE IN SAY, MIDDLE SCHOOL, UH, JUNIOR HIGH IT WAS CALLED.
WE WOULD COME BACK TO THE, THE GYM IN THE HIGH SCHOOL ON FRIDAY NIGHTS.
WELL, HE'S, HIS NAME IS COMMEMORATED AS, YES, WE GO BY IT, THE PARK IN HIS NAME.
HE WAS A NATURALIST, AN OUTDOORS PERSON, AND A SUPER SCOUT.
AND HE HAD A LOT OF INFLUENCE IN MY LIFE.
ALWAYS WALK TO THE RIGHT, SWING YOUR ARMS, STAY, FACE THE TRAFFIC, AND THINGS LIKE THAT, OR ALWAYS SAID, HAVE THE TRAFFIC BEHIND YOU THAT I'M NOT SO SURE OF.
UH, SO, AND THEN WE WOULD HAVE THE CUBS, UH, THE DEN MEETING, CUBS MEETING.
I LIKED THE IDEA OF BEING ABLE TO SURVIVE IN THE WILD.
SO YEAH, PLAYING, UH, PLAYING BASEBALL WAS PART OF IT.
AND THEN COMING DOWN HERE TO REYNOLDS FIELD, UH, TO THE, TO COME TO PLAY TENNIS.
I DID IT WITH MY SISTER THAT I DID IT WITH MY FRIENDS ON NEIGHBORS.
AND I, I PLAYED A PRETTY GOOD GAME.
I GOT ON THE TEAM IN COLLEGE, LAST POSITION, BUT I MADE SURE I GOT IT.
UH, WERE THERE RE, WERE THERE RESTAURANTS OR PLACES THAT YOU AND YOUR FRIENDS WOULD GO AFTER SCHOOL? YEAH, THERE WAS, UH, DOC JACOBSON'S, UH, DINER.
I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S STILL A DINER THERE ON WAR BURTON AVENUE, BUT THAT WAS A HANGOUT.
AND THERE WAS THE MOVIE THEATER.
BUT, UM, JOHN IN VIRGINIA AND JOANNA MCINTYRE DIDN'T, WERE NOT ENCOURAGED TO DO ANY OF THAT.
WE CAME HOME, CUT THE LAWN, WASHED THE CAR, AND DID THINGS LIKE THAT.
I DON'T HAVE ANY GOOD STORIES FOR YOU THERE.
HAVE YOU NOTICED A DIFFERENCE IN DIFFERENCE HASTINGS TODAY THAN WHEN YOU GREW UP? OH, VERY DEFINITELY.
WELL, WE WERE STILL A FACTORY TOWN WHEN I WAS GROWING UP.
UH, A LOT OF MY CLASSMATES HAD POLISH NAMES AND SOME ITALIAN NAMES, AND, UH, YES, WE WERE DIVIDED THAT WAY.
IT'S BEEN SO WELL STUDIED BY THE HISTORICAL SOCIETY.
THEY'VE HAD SO MANY GOOD, AND INCLUDING RECENT EXHIBITS OF WHAT IT WAS LIKE TO HAVE ANA CONNA DOWN ALONG THE HIGHWAY.
THE STORIES ABOUT WHAT THEY WERE DOING DURING WORLD WAR I AND THE, THE BUILDING, THE MAKING OF NERVE GAS OR MUST GAS RIGHT HERE IN HASTINGS AFFECTED ME.
LEMME TELL YOU ABOUT SOMETHING, WHICH NOBODY ELSE WOULD'VE EVER DONE.
I WAS LIKE, AS I SAID, PRETTY MUCH BENT ON GETTING THE BEST MARKS AND THE GREATEST NUMBER OF CREDITS FOR GRADUATION POSSIBLE.
BUT I HAD A FRIEND FOR A COUPLE YEARS NAMED WARREN MILES, WHO DIDN'T EVEN GRADUATE WITH US, AND I HAD NEVER BEEN ABLE TO FIND A GAME.
BUT HE AND I WENT ON BICYCLE TRIPS BETWEEN SOPHOMORE AND JUNIOR YEAR AND JUNIOR AND SENIOR YEAR.
IT MAY HAVE BEEN A YEAR EARLIER, BUT IT WAS IDIOTIC.
WE RODE OUR BICYCLES NORTH UP BROADWAY, UP ROUTE NINE AS FAR AS YOU COULD GO.
AND WE ENDED UP GETTING TO THE LAKE GEORGE ON OUR OWN BIKES.
[01:00:01]
HE HAD A RACING BIKE WITH NARROW TIRES.I HAD ONE WITH BALLOON TIRES, AND IT WAS HUFF AND PUFF ALL THE WAY.
AND WE ONLY HAD A COUPLE DOLLARS.
WE DID NOT PAY TO SLEEP ANYWHERE.
WE RAN UNDER SOMEBODY'S FORMER PORCH AND FOUND OUT THAT ALL THE IN, UH, MOSQUITOES HAD THE SAME IDEA.
SO WE RAG THE DOORBELL AND GOT PERMISSION TO SLEEP IN THEIR CAR.
SO WE SURVIVED THAT RAINSTORM.
WE SURVIVED A HORRIBLE WINDSTORM THAT KEPT, NEVER LET US GET PAST ALBANY COMING BACK.
AND WE, WE WORKED FOR EIGHT HOURS, AND I THINK WE BARELY MADE 10, 10 MILES.
BUT AFTER THAT, THINGS WENT FASTER.
AND WE GOT BACK IN MAYBE EIGHT OR NINE DAYS ON THAT TRIP.
AND THE NEXT YEAR, WHAT DID WE DO? THE SAME DARN THING, ONLY THE DESTINATION WAS ITHACA.
THAT MEANT GOING THROUGH THE CATSKILLS, WHICH ARE A LOT HARDER THAN ROUTE NINE GOING NORTH.
WE GOT, UH, FLAT TIRES PERSISTENTLY, BUT THE TWO OF US HAD A GREAT TIME.
I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THIS IS GOING TO BE WORTHWHILE PUTTING IN INTO ANYTHING.
I GRADUATED JUST IN TIME TO BE GET A DRAFT NOTICE BACK IN 1951.
I HAD A REPORT IN OCTOBER, BUT I HAD FROM JUNE 1ST TO OCTOBER 12TH TO DO SOMETHING, AND I DECIDED I WAS GOING TO CROSS THE COUNTRY ON MY OWN.
THEY PUT LITTLE ANNOUNCEMENTS IN THE PAPER IN NEW YORK TIMES SAYING, LOOKING FOR SOMEBODY TO HELP PAY THE EXPENSES.
AND FIRST TIME I WAS THERE WITH, UH, A DRIVER AND A THIRD PERSON, AND WE WENT NONSTOP FROM NEW YORK TO HOLLYWOOD.
THAT MEANT, UH, NOT STOPPING TO CROSS, TO WAIT TO TRY TO CROSS, UH, UH, THE, UH, DESERT IN ARIZONA, UH, AT, BUT WE DID IT ON THE, AT HIGH NOON AND SUFFERED ON ACCOUNT OF THAT.
AND THEN I HITCHHIKED MY WAY BACK ON MY THUMB.
I WORKED AS, UH, ASSISTANT WAY MASTER IN AUBURN, UH, CALIFORNIA, IN A PEACH ORCHARD.
AND THEY HAD THE MIGRANT WORKERS PICKING THEM.
I, I VOLUNTEERED TO DO ANYTHING.
I NEEDED MONEY TO GET BACK HOME.
AND I, SO I GOT 50 CENTS AN HOUR INSTEAD OF 25 CENTS AN HOUR FOR A MONTH, AND I MADE IT BACK.
AND WHAT DID I DO AFTER THAT? I SAW MY SISTER GET MARRIED, AND I HEADED OUT THE NORTHERN ROUTE THE SAME WAY, UH, WITH ONE OTHER PERSON.
AND WE STOPPED AND WENT TO MOTEL.
AND THEN I THUMBED MY WAY DOWN TO, TO SAN FRANCISCO TO SEE PEOPLE I HAD MET DOWN THERE ON THE FIRST TRIP, AND THEN THUMBED MY WAY ACROSS THE, THE SALTED DESERT AT, UH, SALT LAKE CITY, UH, UH, GETTING A LOT OF RIDES WITH, UH, WITH TRUCK DRIVERS, SEEING MY UNCLE IN CINCINNATI AND MAKING IT BACK IN TIME TO REPORT FOR MY, MY PHYSICAL AND GOT DRAFTED.
YOU HAD HAD MENTIONED THAT WHEN YOU WERE GROWING UP IN HASTINGS, THERE WERE A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT ETHNIC GROUPS.
UM, AND THERE WERE A NUMBER OF BARS THAT SPECIFIC ETHNIC GROUPS WOULD GO TO.
UM, DID YOU EVER FREQUENT ANY OF THE BARS? I DID DELIVERING THE HERALD STATESMAN.
I WOULD ALWAYS HAD TO GET SOME EXTRA MONEY.
AND SO MAYBE WHEN I WAS 14, 13, 40, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, I WOULD PICK UP THE PAPERS AND MY, UH, I HAD A ROUTE WHICH I COULD PEDAL AROUND TO SEE, UH, IN MY HOME AROUND RAVENSDALE AND ON UP JACKSON AVENUE, WHERE, WHERE THERE WAS A GIRLS SCHOOL FOR ORPHAN GIRLS,
[01:05:01]
WHERE THERE'S A SCHOOL FOR, OR A HOME FOR RETIRED NUNS.AND THERE, THERE WERE THE OWNERS OF, OR THE PEOPLE WHO MAINTAINED THE VARIOUS CEMETERIES THERE.
AND I WOULD, UH, PEDAL ALL THE WAY UP TO SEE THEM AND BACK, UH, FOR A NICK OR DIAMOND TIPS AT THE END OF THE WEEK.
UH, WHERE AM I IN MY STORYTELLING? SO WITH THE DIFFERENT ETHNIC GROUPS? UH OH, YES.
UH, WELL, IT, IT HAD TO DO WITH RELIGIONS.
I, IT WAS QUITE APPARENT THE, THE PEOPLE WHO WORKED IN THE FACTORIES, UH, MY WHOSE CHILDREN WERE STUDYING IN THE SAME GRADE THAT I WAS STUDYING IN, BUT PROBABLY NOT IN THE SAME COURSES THAT I WAS IN ALL THE TIME.
THEY WENT TO THE CATHOLIC CHURCH, ST.
MATTHEWS AND THE LUTHERAN CHURCH.
UH, A LOT OF, UH, WHAT WE WERE DOING IN THE MCINTYRE FAMILY HAD TO DO WITH THE DUTCH REFORM CHURCH.
MY FATHER WAS AN ELDER, UH, A A DEACON AND AN ELDER.
UM, THE SATURDAYS, UH, SUNDAYS IN PARTICULAR WERE HAD TO DO AROUND THE SERVICES.
THERE WAS A YOUTH GROUP THAT I WAS ASKED TO BE THE LEADER OF, AND WE WOULD GET TOGETHER WITH REVEREND BASEL BROOK AS OUR MENTOR AT THE SAME TIME.
OH, THERE WAS A FUNNY THING THAT MY FATHER AND I DID.
UH, HE WAS BIG ON COMMUNITY AFFAIRS.
HE ENDED UP BEING ONE OF THE ORGANIZERS OF THE INTERFAITH GROUP IN HIS RETIREMENT YEARS HERE IN HASTINGS.
UH, BUT HE PUT ON SHOWS FOR THE PARISHIONERS THAT WERE WORSHIPERS AT THE REFORMED CHURCH ON, UH, ONE SUNDAY EVENING, ONCE OR TWICE A YEAR.
AND SO WE CREATED AN ACT, FATHER AND SON ACT, WHICH, UH, A SHEET WOULD BE PUT DOWN WITH ROOM FOR ME TO PUT MY, TO STAND ON A TABLE AND PUT MY HEAD THROUGH THE HEAD HOLE.
AND MY ARMS CAME THROUGH TWO HOLES AND WERE THE LEGS AND, AND FEET WITH SHOES.
AND MY FATHER'S TWO ARMS CAME AROUND FROM OUTSIDE AND WERE MY ARMS AND HANDS, AND WE DID ALL SORTS OF COMIC ROUTINES IN WHICH, UH, I WOULD SCRATCH MY HEAD WITH MY FOOT
UH, HE CALLED, UH, IT WAS CALLED BUTCH.
AND THAT WAS HIS NICKNAME FOR ME EVER, EVER SINCE AFTER THAT, THAT WAS HIS BUTCH.
WAS, WAS THERE MUCH ANIMOSITY BETWEEN THE DIFFERENT ETHNIC GROUPS IN, IN SCHOOL WITH THE, WITH THE KIDS OR NOT? NOT, NOT, NOT THAT I WAS SEEING, UH, UM, I, I CAN'T SPEAK TO THAT.
YOU KNOW, 36 ASHLEY ROAD WAS SO FAR FROM WAR BURTON AVENUE AND, UH, WASHINGTON STREET AND SO FORTH THAT, UH, NO, I REALLY WASN'T, UH, AWARE OF HOW HETEROGENEOUS OUR, MY HIGH SCHOOL CLASS WAS UNTIL WE BEGAN TO HAVE OUR REUNIONS AFTER THAT.
AND THEN WE COULD SEE THAT THERE REALLY WAS A BIG SEPARATION BETWEEN THOSE THAT WERE IN THE COLLEGE ENTRANCE, FAMILIES, STUDENTS, THE ONES THAT I KNEW AND AS VERY CLOSE FRIENDS AND THE OTHER STUDENTS WE'D ONLY SEE IN JIM AND, AND ON THE ATHLETIC TEAMS. UH, IT, IF I HAD, IT WASN'T UNTIL I GOT WENT TO SWARTHMORE COLLEGE THAT I BEGAN TO, BEGAN TO SEE THAT WE WASPS, WHICH IS WHAT WE WERE, WE'RE NOT THE TOP OF THE PIE, THE THE CHERRY ON TOP OR ANY OTHER THING OF THE SORT.
AND I LEARNED TO, I THINK, LEARN THE LESSON, WHICH FOR ONE THING HELPED ME TO MARRY THE DAUGHTER OF IMMIGRANTS, WHEREAS MY MOTHER'S SIDE OF THE FAMILY TRACES ITSELF ALL THE WAY BACK
[01:10:01]
TO THE, THE MAYFLOWER.AND, WELL, ONCE AGAIN, I'M NOT, I'M, I'M, I'M AFRAID I CAN'T REALLY TALK IT WELL THAT I KNEW THAT I WAS NOT TO ASK ELLENOR DEUTSCH OUT ON A DATE BECAUSE SHE WAS NOT PROTESTANT.
SHE WAS THE CUTEST GIRL IN MY CLASS.
AND JUST, IT GOT THE SAME AS GOOD GRADES AS I DID.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, SHE WAS THE VALEDICTORIAN.
SO I, I CAN'T REALLY TELL HER ABOUT IT, BUT I'M, I'M CERTAINLY INTERESTED IN COMMUNITY RELATIONS.
MY FATHER WOKE UP TO THE FACT THAT HETERO, THAT, UH, DIVERSITY IS, IS GOOD.
HE HELPED THE JEWISH CONGREGATION THAT NOW IS ON THE HASTING STOPS VERY BORDER.
WE HAVE FRIENDS WHO WORSHIP THERE.
UM, HE HELPED THEM USE THE FELLOWSHIP HELP FOR THE DUTCH REFORMED CHURCH AS THEIR SYNAGOGUE ON WEEKENDS.
AND HE WAS VERY PROUD THAT HE, UH, HAD A FINE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE, WITH THE RABBI THERE.
AND WE SPEND, MARIE AND I, MY WIFE, MY, THE DAUGHTER OF MY SPANISH FATHER-IN-LAW AND MY ITALIAN MOTHER-IN-LAW, WE'VE GOT GREAT CHILDREN.
THEY'RE ONE QUARTER ITALIAN AND SPANISH AS WELL AS SCOTTISH AND ENGLISH.
UM, UH, IT HELPS IT WITH, SO WE, WE DO THE BEST WE CAN TO, TO SEE THE VALUE IN EVERYBODY AT ONE TIME.
WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR SHARING YOUR EXPERIENCES AND, AND YOUR LIFE.
SO THANK YOU AND REALLY APPRECIATE IT.
I, THE GROWING UP YEARS HERE MEANT SO MUCH TO ME AND IT'S, IT'S SO WONDERFUL THAT OUR DAUGHTER AND SON-IN-LAW AND THEIR CHILDREN CHOSE TO LIVE IN HASTINGS.
GIVE ME MULTIPLE TIMES EACH, EACH YEAR TO COME BACK HERE, GO TO THE SCHOOL, HEAR CONCERTS AND SO FORTH.
THANKS FOR WATCHING AND WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT TIME.